tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post2623397586917231308..comments2024-03-12T04:14:16.271-05:00Comments on The Rad Trad: Your Old [Wo]men Will Dream Dreams: Mysticism and Its PitfallsThe Rad Tradhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-458400667560252922018-08-31T07:16:26.422-05:002018-08-31T07:16:26.422-05:00I was relieved and rejuvenated upon first learning...I was relieved and rejuvenated upon first learning that Private Revelation is not required belief for Catholics.<br />Putting my faith and eternal salvation into the hands of 3 Shepard children from 1917 Portugal is not theologically sound while insulting practical logic. Catholic Statehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09107971443683193051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-5184595434696646302018-08-11T09:04:33.972-05:002018-08-11T09:04:33.972-05:00Is there any contradiction between the 'Ephesu...Is there any contradiction between the 'Ephesus' version and that of Jerusalem? If according to a solid tradition St. John lived for some time in Ephesus and according to the Gospel took our Lady to himself, then she may have lived there and then made her last earthly journey to Jerusalem.Pulexhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13164993172745639593noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-69960278233060183252018-08-10T11:52:23.901-05:002018-08-10T11:52:23.901-05:00I believe Dr K may be referring to the first centu...I believe Dr K may be referring to the first century house/fourth century church found by a nun in 19th century Ephesus after reading Emmerich’s visions and assuming the house must also still exist (I’m not sure if this conflicts with the separate Loreto tradition based on a house from Jerusalem). <br /><br />The basic problem with the Ephesians house is obvious: ancient churches loved to brag of their apostolicity. Rome still lives on Peter & Paul, Alexandria on Mark, India on Thomas etc. Christianity in Ephesus dates from the time of Saint Paul and probably enjoyed some interactions with John the Evangelist, too, which reflect in written history. Would not the presence of the Virgin herself warrant such a prestige and tradition?<br /><br />Moreover, a first century house turned into a church is also fairly unremarkable. Buildings were used until they collapsed in those days and Christians met in houses until the Edict of Milan, and even then some houses became churches because of martyrdoms and what not that had taken place there.<br /><br />Lastly, the NLM article’s comments were my impetus to publish this post, but the inspiration and even decision to write something came during a conversation with a friend a month ago, and I was not specifically reacting to anything on NLM, interesting as the comments were.<br /><br />And to clarify, I have little against devotions on their own—in fact they are a symptom of a healthy prayer life—but like other aspects of prayer they have their place. The dominant culture of devotionalism in the years after the Reformation did great damage to the place of the Latin liturgy and its continued presence in some quarters of the Traditionalist world thwart both parish life and the broader restoration of the liturgy. When I first went into the FSSP church in Dallas three different people tried to force a scapular on my neck, which is extreme but does reflect a cultural under current.The Rad Tradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-89575104269995094562018-08-10T03:15:36.462-05:002018-08-10T03:15:36.462-05:00This is the a Reason why from the Eastern Schism o...This is the a Reason why from the Eastern Schism onwards,Our Roman Liturgy became messed up slowly. Josemaria Paulo Jeromino Martin Carvalho-Von Versterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00128928800453615354noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-17640778991285314162018-08-09T09:15:04.514-05:002018-08-09T09:15:04.514-05:00Without wishing to impugn anyone's point of vi...Without wishing to impugn anyone's point of view the most shocking thing I find is how modern ideas trump those of considerable age and usage in the Church. St. John Damascene's writings, amongst others, on the death of the Virgin can just be cast aside and binned. The relative weight given to ancient liturgical texts in comparison to visions is quite extraordinary. Such disregard for our liturgical and patristic heritage is not healthy to say the least.Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-28728294569160013962018-08-08T14:57:41.309-05:002018-08-08T14:57:41.309-05:00I am curious: what "archaeological evidence&q...I am curious: what "archaeological evidence" does proof that the Mother of God lived in Ephesus?Ἰουστινιανόςhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00853873178362328543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-68462404757891244642018-08-08T10:06:14.983-05:002018-08-08T10:06:14.983-05:00The Rad Trad can defend himself, but I like to poi...The Rad Trad can defend himself, but I like to point out that in the circles I've been in, if you even question a devotion's origins or some apparitions (for example, Mount Carmel), you'll be instantly condemned as a Modernist. If you don't follow what every Traditionalist "must do" (i.e., enroll in the Brown Scapular, Five First Saturdays, First Fridays, etc.), you are a Modernist! The Rad Trad and I have had our exposure to many people insisting on some private devotion or another as a sure way to be saved!!Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08395971347119256329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-8440144328515278912018-08-08T09:22:11.873-05:002018-08-08T09:22:11.873-05:00Not everyone has such a negative evaluation of Bre...Not everyone has such a negative evaluation of Brentano's collaboration. As for anyone who has anything to do with the Vatican and its saints factory, I will trust them when I see that they are not infected with modernism.<br /><br />Here is what James Wetmore writes about Brentano in these new volumes:<br /><br />"Brentano, a novelist and Romantic poet then living in Berlin, was associated with leading members of the Romantic Movement in Germany. He settled his affairs and moved from Berlin to Dülmen early in 1819. Thereafter he visited Anne Catherine every morning, noting down briefly all she related to him. After writing out a full report at home, he returned later the same day to read it back to her. She would then often expand upon certain points, or, if necessary, correct details.<br /><br />"Anyone who does even minimal research on the visions of Anne Catherine Emmerich as depicted in the works attributed to Brentano’s notes will soon discover that there are conflicting opinions regarding their fidelity to the words of Anne Catherine herself. This would be a subject in itself, but some remarks may be offered here. First, Anne Catherine, who had little formal education, spoke in a Low-German dialect that even Brentano, at the outset, had some difficulty understanding. Secondly, the material that was eventually fit together into a connected account in the published versions often represents a collation of as many as a dozen or more passages gleaned from visions separated sometimes by months, or even years. This can be partially explained by the fact that the visions were often related to events in the ecclesiastical year, to feasts of saints, to individuals with specific needs or requests, or to the presence of relics.<br /><br />"And so a great deal of work had to be done to organize and knit together related segments of visions, and to then arrange them in a meaningful sequence. Then again, it was deemed necessary to refine the language sufficiently to render it in a more contemporary idiom. There is, then, a legitimate concern that so famous and gifted a literary figure as Clemens Brentano might, even if unintentionally, have introduced some of his own impressions, interpretations, and sensitivities into his renditions.<br /><br />"It needs to be said also, in response to assertions (made mostly without benefit of access to his actual notes) that Brentano misrepresented Anne Catherine, or, even worse, took advantage of his notes to compile an independent literary work that might<br />embellish his reputation, that in fact, in his notes, Brentano candidly reports exactly what he heard Anne Catherine say, no matter how extraordinary, puzzling, or even apparently contradictory. He himself offers many instances where only later—sometimes years after Anne Catherine had died—he (often with the help of academic experts) finally began to understand previously incomprehensible passages in the visions. He steadfastly refused—according to his own account and that of others—to edit out “difficulties,” feeling himself, rather, under a sacred obligation to preserve his record intact and unaltered for posterity. And when the notes passed to his brother Christian, the latter adhered to the same policy."Peter Kwasniewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05136784193150446335noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-27138603057867429112018-08-07T23:24:07.115-05:002018-08-07T23:24:07.115-05:00In the case of Anne Catherine Emmerich, there'...In the case of Anne Catherine Emmerich, there's the additional problem that the writer of her biography and other visions, Clemens Brentano, embellished a lot of things, with his own words, so that nearly all his books are worthless, according to the postulator for Anne Katherine's cause for beatification. In fact, all the writings were discarded by the Vatican; they only focused on her personal piety, to declare her Blessed.Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08395971347119256329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-8772291678269457402018-08-07T22:09:45.985-05:002018-08-07T22:09:45.985-05:00Some good thoughts in here, but it's clear wha...Some good thoughts in here, but it's clear what NLM piece prompted this reflection, and equally clear that you haven't taken into account my responses to the various readers who objected to the mere fact of my bringing up Anne Catherine Emmerich. Not sure, though, why you are so relentlessly ornery about devotions that can have a legitimate place in Catholic life.<br /><br />Also, I suppose you reject the archaeological and devotional evidence pointing to a house of the Virgin Mary in Ephesus, where she lived with John? Yes, it isn't the tradition about Mary's death in Jerusalem, but my understanding is that that tradition was not unanimous. Beyond that, there is surely no consensus, not least among traditionalists, that the Virgin died, as opposed to "slept" in a way that should not be called death univocally.Peter Kwasniewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05136784193150446335noreply@blogger.com