tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post6174100249277397672..comments2024-03-12T04:14:16.271-05:00Comments on The Rad Trad: Tradistan, Neo-Con Whackos & the EastThe Rad Tradhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-56160790122882553782014-11-21T15:35:36.588-06:002014-11-21T15:35:36.588-06:00Like this?
http://www.uscatholic.org/church/praye...Like this?<br /><br />http://www.uscatholic.org/church/prayer-and-sacraments/2009/11/mass-instruction-fr-robert-taft-liturgical-reform<br /><br />I have never read an article like this where I'm shaking my head in disagreement on half the paragraphs ("Pope Pius XII restored the celebration of the Easter Vigil in 1951") and clapping in agreement in the other half of the paragraphs("One of the dumbest ideas in the world was invented in the ninth century when someone came up with the notion that something was either symbolic or real. The Eucharist is both symbolic and real"). <br /><br />Everything in the article elicits a strong reaction, positive or negative.Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-55179935002864493012014-11-21T14:50:20.034-06:002014-11-21T14:50:20.034-06:00Oh, I'll give Fr. Taft credit for his obvious ...Oh, I'll give Fr. Taft credit for his obvious virtues - he knows his area well, and he's no company-line man (a rarity today, alas). I agree with MJY that we could use more of that brio among our clerics.<br /><br />He is exasperating on a few subjects, however, and this post touches on two of them: traditional Roman Rite liturgy, and the Bestest of all Councils That Ever Was. Athelstanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07346012062816580296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-38611444410000874442014-11-21T01:02:14.280-06:002014-11-21T01:02:14.280-06:00Taft is the true successor of St. Jerome the Great...Taft is the true successor of St. Jerome the Great Name-Caller and a welcome respite from the countless ass-kissers in the Latin Church.Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-19638268283592305472014-11-20T08:25:33.226-06:002014-11-20T08:25:33.226-06:00Taft is a blast to read and to listen to even when...Taft is a blast to read and to listen to even when one vehemently disagrees with him. M.J wants more clerics like himMick Jagger Gathers No Mosquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12879499915093940176noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-4214621586635291762014-11-19T21:42:13.914-06:002014-11-19T21:42:13.914-06:00P.S. "In an interview with progressive blogge...P.S. <i>"In an interview with progressive blogger Anthony Ruff OSB, Robert Taft SJ branded all who disfavor the Spirit of Vatican II "neo-con whackos."</i><br /><br />Fr. Taft is not without knowledge of affairs of the east, but this single statement confirms that he knows less than nothing about Catholic traditionalism.<br /><br />Meanwhile, in genuine Neo-Con News, John Paul II's biographer <a href="http://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2014/11/vatican-ii-and-the-berlin-wall" rel="nofollow">is busy making the case today</a> for crediting the True Vatican II for the fall of the Berlin Wall. Athelstanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07346012062816580296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-32886960873028091592014-11-19T20:14:40.319-06:002014-11-19T20:14:40.319-06:00Rorate Caeli no longer allows comments, so I am no...<i>Rorate Caeli no longer allows comments, so I am not sure what Mr. Voris has been reading.</i><br /><br />At a guess: places like Eponymous Flower or half a dozen other trad blogs RC keeps on its sidebar blog roll. But I suspect his own email box is quite the rumpus room, too. Athelstanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07346012062816580296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-59868543519948300862014-11-19T18:03:12.661-06:002014-11-19T18:03:12.661-06:00I would agree, the pope was the champion of orthod...I would agree, the pope was the champion of orthodoxy on more than one occasion, however, his claims of universal jurisdiction and infallibility have been the source of many "misunderstandings" and has driven a wedge between Rome and other Apostolic Churches.<br /><br />Concerning Batholomew's rather strange comment, perhaps he has had a change of heart. If so he should clarify his current position on the issue. I'm all in favor of preserving our environment, however, halting abortion under any and all circumstances is even more pressing. As Ronald Reagan once said, "I can't help but notice that all those people in favor of abortion have already been born."Prior Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15676817526437140998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-22296074379667825302014-11-19T15:56:45.100-06:002014-11-19T15:56:45.100-06:00I'll agree. Those are extremely troubling sta...I'll agree. Those are extremely troubling statements.<br />”generally speaking"<br />"There are many reasons for a couple to go toward abortion.”<br /><br />It is possible that (like Joseph Ratzinger) he might have moved to a more orthodox position over time.Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-28263818091047197922014-11-19T15:50:46.669-06:002014-11-19T15:50:46.669-06:00Bartholomew made some very troubling statements in...Bartholomew made some very troubling statements in the 1990s (prior to his election) which he has never denounced or explained. So one must take him at his word.<br /><br />"When asked the Orthodox church’s position on abortion, Bartholomais described a stand more liberal than that of the Roman Catholic Church, which condemns abortion in all cases and whose clergy have, in some cities, excommunicated leading pro-choice Catholics.<br /><br />Although the Orthodox church believes the soul enters the body at conception and, ”generally speaking, respects human life and the continuation of pregnancy,” Bartholomais said, the church also ”respects the liberty and freedom of all human persons and all Christian couples.”<br /><br />”We are not allowed to enter the bedrooms of the Christian couples,” he said. ”We cannot generalize. There are many reasons for a couple to go toward abortion.” Prior Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15676817526437140998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-80582821274587196332014-11-19T15:31:24.222-06:002014-11-19T15:31:24.222-06:00Wait a sec... Bartholomew is Pro-Abortion?
I assu...Wait a sec... Bartholomew is Pro-Abortion?<br /><br />I assumed the opposite was true.<br /><br />http://www.catholic.org/news/international/europe/story.php?id=53709<br />"For 2013 years Our Lord is killed every day in the person of thousands of embryos killed by the will of their parents. For 2013 years have passed and Christ is mocked and ridiculed in the person of unfortunate children, who experience the crisis of the family, destitution and poverty". And 2013 years have passed and "our Creator incarnate is still being persecuted by contemporary Herods in the Christians in Syria and elsewhere."Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-25503810582090722172014-11-19T15:25:10.137-06:002014-11-19T15:25:10.137-06:00I know next to nothing about Bartholomew, but I wo...I know next to nothing about Bartholomew, but I would take Francis over a pro-abortion patriarch any day (perhaps there is a silver lining to this pontificate).<br /><br />The Roman liturgy was not consigned to the dustbin at the stroke of a pen. If you ever wish, read some of my posts from mid last year. My belief is that the devotional and legal culture put it out of use over the course of centuries. The "stroke of the pen" approach had been tried without success against many local rites in the Middle Ages without success. The way the Church found herself in the 20th century made the changes possible, not necessary just Pacelli and Paul VI. <br /><br />As someone who attended a Melkite church for a few years, I would point out that the "Orthodox polity" did consign the Antiochian liturgy to the dustbin and replaced it with the Byzantine rite in the 11th century. Then again, that was when Eastern Christianity was highly centralized and the Emperor was basically a Greek pope with a large army.The Rad Tradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-54454847930678859812014-11-19T15:23:29.788-06:002014-11-19T15:23:29.788-06:00I would argue that the damage done by those who id...I would argue that the damage done by those who idolized the pope (the ultramontanists and neo-ultramontanists) far exceeds that done by any of the popes personally; be that pope Pius XII, Benedict IX, Stephen VI/VII, Alexander VI, Paul VI, Urban VIII, Pius X, John Paul II, or Leo X.<br /><br />Do certain popes have much to answer for? Without a doubt. However, we cannot blame all the ills of the church on them. In all the first 7 ecumenical councils except V and VI the bishop of Rome was often the defender of orthodoxy.Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-81604334683539405502014-11-19T15:19:26.374-06:002014-11-19T15:19:26.374-06:00Francis should have no greater control over your b...Francis should have no greater control over your beloved liturgy than the pro-abortion, environmentalist liberal currently occupying the See of Constantinople, Bartholomew the Idiot, has over the liturgy celebrated by the vast majority of Orthodox bishops and priests. If Catholicism had a polity similar to that of Orthodox your liturgy would not have been tossed into the dustbin of history with the mere stroke of a pen. One bad Greek Patriarch can't destroy the Orthodox Church, but one bad Roman Pope can wreak havoc in the Catholic Church for generations.Prior Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15676817526437140998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-14376556430365195192014-11-19T14:39:03.960-06:002014-11-19T14:39:03.960-06:00"Virtually all the ills of Apostolic Christia..."Virtually all the ills of Apostolic Christianity can be laid at the feet of the Man in Rome."<br /><br />Really? I'd have blamed the Byzantine emperors, a few Greek Patriarchs, ambitious kings, and worldly bishops before I would even blame specific popes, much less assign the entire papacy to the dustbin.The Rad Tradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-56964368018212145272014-11-19T14:23:39.873-06:002014-11-19T14:23:39.873-06:00I couldn't agree more with Patricius. As one w...I couldn't agree more with Patricius. As one who survived the horrors of VC2, I can't help but chuckle to myself when read about all the wailing, hand wringing and gnashing of teeth amongst the Tradistanis. They try every way known to man to justify their opposition without insulting or openly rejecting the Man in Rome. Do you worship Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ or do you worship the Man in Rome? Virtually all the ills of Apostolic Christianity can be laid at the feet of the Man in Rome. Until traditionalists realize that he is the source of their problems their misery will continue ad infinitum.Prior Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15676817526437140998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-41269648237743584912014-11-19T12:42:10.141-06:002014-11-19T12:42:10.141-06:00I have come to respect the Sedevacantist position ...I have come to respect the Sedevacantist position in the last three years; not because of their high Ultramontane view (which I understand as Ultramontanism in reverse) but because they have the honesty to view the modern Roman communion as in a state of de facto schism with her own Tradition, without ascribing hermeneutics of continuity to self-evident ruptures in praxis and teaching. Their chief fault lies in their understanding of how far back the problems go, not necessarily what the problems are.Patrick Sheridanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07995907911415177074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-91985871224217234232014-11-19T10:08:30.942-06:002014-11-19T10:08:30.942-06:00So, is it /Træd-i-stæn/ or a more Biden-esque /Tra...So, is it /Træd-i-stæn/ or a more Biden-esque /Trah-dih-stahn/ ?A. T. Wallacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02816243030572765014noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-86425647141721546102014-11-19T09:39:38.101-06:002014-11-19T09:39:38.101-06:00Mr. Voris' vlogs are bankrolled by an Opus Dei...Mr. Voris' vlogs are bankrolled by an Opus Dei numerary, hence his official support of the prelature (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjIKZxfY6D4), and his acceptance of the OD ultramontane party line. "The Work" is beholden to no local bishop because of its status as a personal prelature, so they have no problem with carpet-bombing any bishop they dislike. The best thing about Voris' affiliation with OD is that he could finally afford to buy a well-fitted suit coat!J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02124903563459448051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-48187197231549788792014-11-19T08:22:22.728-06:002014-11-19T08:22:22.728-06:00If I ever write my fictionalized auto-biography, I...If I ever write my fictionalized auto-biography, I'm calling it "Tradistan"!Joanneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00496552906164909711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-27625676362385031702014-11-19T08:06:13.089-06:002014-11-19T08:06:13.089-06:00"There is also the nonsensical moment at 3:00..."There is also the nonsensical moment at 3:00 when he assails the Tradistanis for wishing to uphold traditional teachings and practices, and then proceeds to compare the those people with the progressives who wish for a change in teaching, as if an equivalency exists betwixt the two."<br /><br />Reminds me of a 1979 Firing Line episode (my paraphrasing).<br />"In fact, I see many similarities between Lefebvre and Hans Kung..."- Msgr. Joseph Champlin<br />"Now Monsignor, I find your comparison a bit problematic. Kung is an outright heretic who denies papal infallibility, the priesthood, the immaculate conception and the Real Prescence; but Lefebvre has never done all that."- Malachi MartinEcclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.com