tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post1681937232583382001..comments2024-03-12T04:14:16.271-05:00Comments on The Rad Trad: Short BreakThe Rad Tradhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-61024028203769262992014-12-12T18:21:16.771-06:002014-12-12T18:21:16.771-06:00Yes, if anyone has any good Eastern Catholic litur...Yes, if anyone has any good Eastern Catholic liturgical (especially as regards the non-Byzantine rites) resources they know of please do let me know. I have some knowledge, but I could always use more.<br /><br />If anyone has anything on the ancient Maronite rituals that would REALLY be something.Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-65539557172705259542014-12-12T16:29:42.312-06:002014-12-12T16:29:42.312-06:00No... Uptown is more fitting. Highland Park or Oa...No... Uptown is more fitting. Highland Park or Oak Lawn.Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-72740708918159825412014-12-12T16:23:20.183-06:002014-12-12T16:23:20.183-06:00Shops at Legacy?Shops at Legacy?The Rad Tradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-7851938749058483052014-12-12T15:44:29.067-06:002014-12-12T15:44:29.067-06:00We should open a liturgical boutique in Uptown.We should open a liturgical boutique in Uptown.J.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02124903563459448051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-6435512026103839142014-12-12T14:36:48.265-06:002014-12-12T14:36:48.265-06:00Joseph: exactly!
Anyway, using "v" and ...Joseph: exactly!<br /><br />Anyway, using "v" and "j" or not is just a personal choice. Nothing more, nothing less.<br /><br />K. e.Ἰουστινιανόςhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00853873178362328543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-63450306777827176802014-12-12T14:08:39.387-06:002014-12-12T14:08:39.387-06:00My brain hurts !!!My brain hurts !!!Zephyrinushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01179350648709554049noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-66857977513523430612014-12-12T12:55:25.267-06:002014-12-12T12:55:25.267-06:00I always write Latin with a J; it's easier to ...I always write Latin with a J; it's easier to read (for me at least). Plus all the liturgical books before 1956 used the J, even in "Alleluja". Rightly or wrongly, I associate the "I" purism with the Pacellian destruction. Joanneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00496552906164909711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-40969807232884326302014-12-12T12:35:33.686-06:002014-12-12T12:35:33.686-06:00So do you write e.g. "formauerunt"?So do you write e.g. "formauerunt"?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00167443887449854135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-17016385324560826732014-12-12T11:20:32.179-06:002014-12-12T11:20:32.179-06:00Latin has neither "j" nor "v" ...Latin has neither "j" nor "v" (only "i" and "u", whose capital form is "V"), "u" in a consonatincal position being pronounced (in Classical Latin) likely as the English "w". The use of "v" (but not of "j") is a mere convention.<br /><br />During the Middle Ages graphic evolution brought forth the appearing of a form of lenght "i", which later would became our "j", and capital "V" was also written sometimes in a more rounded-shape form, which would became our "U". Also "ae" and "oe", which appeared already in Antiquity as "æ" and "œ" (and there were many more abbreviations like these) were written in Medieval texts most usually as "e". With printing, standardization began: "j" was used after another "i" (e. g. <i> Filij tui</i>), while "v" was used only at the beginning of a word - take a look at any XVI century liturgical book. "I" and "V" were still the only capital forms. Only on the late XVII c. "j/J" and "v/U" began to be used in the way we see in later Breviaries and Missals (and also in vernacular scripts), i. e. with a consonantic function. But, by the end of the XIX century, it became a custom to use only "i" but to retain "v" in printed scripts.<br /><br />I personally almost never use "v" nor "j" while writing in Latin.<br /><br />K. e.Ἰουστινιανόςhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00853873178362328543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-79295600720029369062014-12-12T10:34:10.808-06:002014-12-12T10:34:10.808-06:00Good luck with the job, (you'll be easier to t...Good luck with the job, (you'll be easier to track down for that beer we talked about next time I'm in Dallas), but you should still move back to the snow and maple trees! -;)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-52689278112509385052014-12-12T09:59:09.149-06:002014-12-12T09:59:09.149-06:00Dear R.T. Good luck with the move and M.J. anticip...Dear R.T. Good luck with the move and M.J. anticipates with delight your return to this Great Blog.<br /><br />You are a true treasure of this church during this execrable ecclesiastical epoch.Mick Jagger Gathers No Mosquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12879499915093940176noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-71526222080747795702014-12-12T09:37:21.862-06:002014-12-12T09:37:21.862-06:00The Latin I learned in school had no "j"...The Latin I learned in school had no "j". Do we know if the "j" is the result of orthographic corruption or if it is something imported from a local (Germanic?) tongue?The Rad Tradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00899289024837953345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-69544189986743320772014-12-12T09:33:01.410-06:002014-12-12T09:33:01.410-06:00Technically, the Boutique started in Dallas (with ...Technically, the Boutique started in Dallas (with the notoriously gay uptown, it fit right in). In Fort Worth, being a true Texas-style town, the Boutique might be a bit out of place. ;)Ecclesial Vigilantehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17070187926547373245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-10206271974500109082014-12-12T08:00:16.191-06:002014-12-12T08:00:16.191-06:00And what, pray, is "living liturgical Latin?&...And what, pray, is "living liturgical Latin?" Of the kind that is not understanded of the people? Or the celebrant? There is no "j" in Latin. How do you pronounce "Jucundare?"Patrick Sheridanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07995907911415177074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-17689677479184439922014-12-12T07:57:33.677-06:002014-12-12T07:57:33.677-06:00During my liberal darkness, I used to serve an &qu...During my liberal darkness, I used to serve an "Old Roman Catholic church" during Holy Week. The celebrant there not only pronounced Latin in an Italianate way but assumed a completely different voice, cadence and rhythm altogether that one thought it gave him opportunity to be more theatrical than he ever was in person.Patrick Sheridanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07995907911415177074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-23321932034771570502014-12-12T07:56:42.172-06:002014-12-12T07:56:42.172-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Patrick Sheridanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07995907911415177074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-24605645454988039202014-12-12T07:23:30.133-06:002014-12-12T07:23:30.133-06:00Pope St. Pius X is regularly critiqued on this blo...Pope St. Pius X is regularly critiqued on this blog, so you all are probably aware that pronouncing Latin like modern Italian was only universalized during his reign. I surmise that's probably the reason why the I vs J distinction was dropped in the 20th century.<br /><br />So on that subject, I was wondering if anybody has been to an Old Catholic Church that has used liturgical Latin; and if so, did they pronounce it like Italians?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00167443887449854135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-85180676241218967482014-12-12T06:56:59.675-06:002014-12-12T06:56:59.675-06:00I vs. J; just the kind of combox war Rad Trad had ...I vs. J; just the kind of combox war Rad Trad had in mind! Classical Latin may not have a J, but living liturgical Latin certainly does! Jucundare!Joanneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00496552906164909711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-61928271052137397632014-12-12T06:38:32.608-06:002014-12-12T06:38:32.608-06:00I'm glad you said Iesus rather than Jesus. The...I'm glad you said Iesus rather than Jesus. There is no "j" in Latin.<br /><br />I enjoy reading Logismoi, an Orthodox site dedicated to Tolkien, the middle ages and such things.Patrick Sheridanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07995907911415177074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3348523519788188753.post-15398660171458668722014-12-12T06:37:23.757-06:002014-12-12T06:37:23.757-06:00Will The Liturgical Boutique be moving to Fort Wor...Will The Liturgical Boutique be moving to Fort Worth, as well, or remaining in Houston ?<br /><br />Best Wishes for the move and the new job.<br /><br />in Domino<br />Zephyrinushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01179350648709554049noreply@blogger.com